Sometimes, it's about when NOT to draw

[Bob Ouellette]

Some background to the situation: I was at the dog park one day and there was a man there whose dog had attacked mine a couple of weeks before. I had politely told the man (who had done nothing to control his dog) that if he can not control his dog, to take him and leave. I had seen him one time since that incident and there was no attack. The next time I saw him, his dog attacked a 6 month old yellow lab. There are signs at the park entrances that specifically say "No aggressive dogs allowed."

As soon as I heard the attack, I rushed over to get the aggressive dog off the puppy. After I had stopped the attack, I looked at the man and yelled "You need to get your dog and get the f*ck out of here." The man picked up his walking stick and started to walk towards me yelling all kind of threats to beat my ass. I told him many times to stop walking towards me.

My first instinct was to put my hand on the 9mm I had in my back pocket, but after a second, I backed up and pulled out my phone instead. I knew I could easily outrun the man and called 911, trying to diffuse the situation instead of making it worse. The entire time I was on the phone, he did not stop threatening me or following me around the park. I knew that pulling my gun would have put a quick end to the situation, but also would have escalated it far beyond where it ever needed to go.

I was disappointed that the Charleston Police did nothing, even blaming me and the owners of the dog that was attacked for causing the problem and telling us that we don't want to be the cause of the park getting shut down. I was too much in shock to remember to get their names and badge numbers.

 

[C_Carson]

I think you handled that very well; it's best to only draw when you fear for your life, and best to not have to draw at all. Way to go trying to de-escalate the issue. However, since he was advancing towards you with a weapon, making verbal threats, I would think you'd be justified in drawing. If I'd been in your shoes, I probably would have. Again, major kudos for keeping calm and resorting to other methods.

Two thumbs down to the po-po for their attitude regarding the situation. I think you can call the station and request a FOIA, which should include the responding officer's names/badge numbers. The guy was threatening bodily harm; I can't believe they'd let that slide.

 

[Bob Ouellette]

I'm not sure if I conveyed just how bad this guy is at walking... He uses the walking stick to get around, so he wasn't going very fast at all swinging it around in the air :lol: Another park-goer suggested I should have just taken his stick and run.

I figured getting into a fight like that where I was at a clear advantage (even if I was just defending myself) would look bad on my State Trooper application.

 

[C_Carson]

Mmm, very true. Didn't realize he was disadvantaged.

 

[Enjay]

Does the park have any sort of supervision? Perhaps if you take a copy of the report to the park officials they'll contact him and tell him not to bring his dog there any more.
It's unfortunate that the police didn't take this more seriously. My mom was on oxygen, weighed all of 87 pounds soaking wet, had congestive heart failure and COPD and she beat a basketball sized hole through a door with her cane one time when she was angry. If he got a piece of you, say when you were distracted while removing his dog from the puppy, he could have done some real damage.

 

[Frost]

You did the right thing.
If he is handicapped pulling a pistol would have gotten you in far more trouble than it would have been worth.
At a minimum you would have been charged with brandishing (considering the way the officer reacted).
At a maximum he would have gone ape shit when he saw the gun and actually attacked you.
Some people do, they think they are fracking bullet proof and see themselves taking the gun from you.

He truly is an irresponsible pet owner.
I have an animal aggressive dog so I never take her to the park.
I don't even take her to the beach anymore.
She does so love the beach but morons let their dogs run loose.

I am not suggesting you escalate things but it is dangerous for everyone to separate dogs.
Get some pepper spray and lend it to the owner of the next dog that gets attacked.
Is this dog actually biting or is the kind of fight where they make a lot of noise and no one bleeds.
Dogs who attack get better and better at it with practice.

There is only one relatively safe way to separate dogs who are fighting.
Wheelbarrow them and even if you are the only one actively doing it the other dog may bite you going for a free shot at the dog you are controlling.
If the bad guy threatens you again you can threaten to pepper spray him if he does not back off.

This is not what I feel or what I want to say but the best advice any of us can give you is to stay away from that park.
From what you say he will now feel empowered and like his dog be inclined to attack verbally or otherwise again.

 

[Bob Ouellette]

I appreciate the advice. I take my dog to the dog park every day and it's great for her to get the exercise chasing other dogs and squirrels. I'm happy to say that since the incident, I have only seen the man once, and for part of the time he kept his dog leashed. I think by showing I will actually call the police (something I had only said I would do after the first incident when he was verbally assaulting a woman while his dog jumped on her) showed that I'm not afraid to act and stand up to his bullying.

As for not going, if it's not me that stands up to him, I don't think anyone will. And I can't just sit by and let one person ruin a public area for everyone. I don't try to start conflicts, but I've put up with enough crap from people, and have seen other people back down instead of stand up for themselves and what is right, that I will always try to do the right thing. I've already put the phone number for Animal Control in my phone.

There was another incident where a couple of dogs got a bit too excited in the group and started a small fight right under me, but after pushing them apart with my feet (I'd rather get bit on the leg than an arm) I grabbed one and someone else grabbed the other. I'm happy to say that everyone was fine afterwords.

 

[Drexellake]

Being disabled myself I sometimes wonder how a situation would pan out for me if someone smaller than I came at me and I shot them in self defense. At first glance a cop or witness might think because of my size I shouldn't need a gun. And I don't "look" disabled. I'm sure the law would cover me in the long run.

 

[Bob Ouellette]

The biggest thing to remember is that looks can be deceiving

 

[Frost]

I didn't mean to go overboard with advice and opinion.

 

[Drexellake]

I didn't mean to go overboard with advice and opinion.

Being disabled doesn't always exempt one from being able to do bodily harm. Especially when he's brandishing a weapon which it sounds like he was doing in this case. Cops are people too so they will make mistakes.

 

[Bob Ouellette]

I didn't mean to go overboard with advice and opinion.

I'm actually going to get some pepper spray as soon as I can afford it (I'm broke at the moment) and I'll start carrying that. It seems like a nice intermediary step between gun/no gun.

Besides, if no one gave out advice or opinion, there wouldn't be any conversations and people would have to learn about somethings the hard way :roll:

 

[Tigerstripe]

take a cop to the park with you.

 

[Bob Ouellette]

take a cop to the park with you.

I finally got some pepper spray. It's nice to know that I have an intermediary between my gun and nothing.

 

[John Canuck]

Sounds like you handled this well.

It sounds to me like he committed a crime by threatening you with a weapon. Did the police even make a report?

 

[Avtomat-Acolyte]

Go to the police station and ask for the paperwork to lodge a formal complaint. They will have records of officers that were either dispatched or responded to your 911 call on their own.

Follow up with the written complaint in a week and ask to speak to a supervisor.

 

[Bob Ouellette]

Sounds like you handled this well.

It sounds to me like he committed a crime by threatening you with a weapon. Did the police even make a report?

Nope. Instead of trying to make a stink, I'll just make it impossible to ignore if it ever happens again. (Cruddy attitude, but I'm applying for 7 or 8 PD's and I have to report any police interaction to each one of them or I could be disqualified.)

 

[John Canuck]

Sounds like you handled this well.

It sounds to me like he committed a crime by threatening you with a weapon. Did the police even make a report?

Nope. Instead of trying to make a stink, I'll just make it impossible to ignore if it ever happens again. (Cruddy attitude, but I'm applying for 7 or 8 PD's and I have to report any police interaction to each one of them or I could be disqualified.)

The police didn't file a report of a crime that took place? Nice.

 

[Bob Ouellette]

Sounds like you handled this well.

It sounds to me like he committed a crime by threatening you with a weapon. Did the police even make a report?

Nope. Instead of trying to make a stink, I'll just make it impossible to ignore if it ever happens again. (Cruddy attitude, but I'm applying for 7 or 8 PD's and I have to report any police interaction to each one of them or I could be disqualified.)

The police didn't file a report of a crime that took place? Nice.

Yeah, it made me think twice about the relying on the police. If I'm hired by any of the departments I applied for, I don't want to be that kind of cop.