effect of barrel length on a shotgun

Pops

Administrator
I shot a couple of short barrell 12 gague shotguns today.
While my Remmington 1100 has a 28" barrel, I felt like the shorter 18 inch barrells were quite fine as far as muzzell velocity and accuracy. There may be a significant difference over a long bird shot, but I think that the shorter barrells should be quite dependable.

I've heard of 14" and even 12" barrel guns, but I've always heard these short guns wouldn't hit the broad side of a barn.
Even more importantly, the short guns don't generate their full velocity because the wad reached the end of the barrel too quickly.

I'm looking at a Remmington 870, Anyone have any thoughts on the barrell length vs. velocity, etc debate?

Pops
 

Frost

Active Member
There is not enough difference in velocity between a 12 or 14 inch barrel and a 28 inch to matter.
 

HHB Guns

New Member
I'm sure you will be just as happy with an 18.5" as you would a 28". What I would be more concerned with is the pattern you get from a shorter barrel. Normally the 12,14,18.5" barrels come with a fixed cylinder choke which opens up very quickly for shorter distances. The 24,26,28" barrels normally come with a modified choke which will hold together a little further or adjustable/removeable choke which you can change to your shooting for the day.
 

Pops

Administrator
OK, that makes sense.
Then, the speed of the pellets coming out of a shotgun barrel have pretty much reached terminal velocity in about 12" to 14", but the spread of the pellets opens up sooner. which means you might shoot everything around the target except the target. that's what would happen for me, I'm sure :shock:

If I had an 18" barrel with a modified choke, if that evn exists, then the pellet pattern would be relatively close together at a close range and then open up at a little longer range, right?

I don't see a home defense or tactical shotgun as a long range weapon so the pattern spread is probably a moot point when defending your family, but a skeet shooter (would he be called a "skeeter"?) or duck hunter who is shooting 70 yards away needs the pattern to be as tight as possible for as long as possible. An 18" barrel wouldn't be as useful in that case.

Thanx!
Pops
 

Frost

Active Member
Shotguns burn their powder pretty quickly, some of it actually makes excellent magnum pistol powder.
This is part of why muzzle brakes don't work all that well.
Mid brakes are the hot ticket on shotguns.
Remington is often quoted on the internet as saying the powder is burned between 12 and 14 inches.
That is incorrect.
What they actually say is 13"-16" and max velocity is achieved by 20".

Remington
**Snip**
Will a longer shotgun barrel shoot farther?

Modern smokeless powders burn in the first 13 to 16 inches of the barrel and maximum velocities are obtained in the first 20 inches.
Shot will carry the same distance regardless of the barrel length.
Shot pattern will be the same whether the barrel is 21 inches in length or 30 inches in length, if the barrel has the same choke constriction.
Our experts state there would be a small variation in velocity when using a 21-inch barrel as compared with a 30-inch barrel; however, the variation would be immeasurable.
The basic advantage of a shorter barrel is that it will swing faster.
The longer barrel gives the hunter a longer sight radius to be more precise, particularly when pass shooting waterfowl.
Also, the longer barrel can often help balance certain shotguns better.

http://remington.custhelp.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/51/kw/Shotgun pattern barrel length/r_id/166
**Snip**

What you could do is get a short barrel with an adjustable choke.
That way you could tune the spread to your liking.


At defensive ranges I would be willing to bet there won't be enough difference between 12" and 18" to matter.
Watch this video and see what you think.
http://americangundog.com/movies/AGD1-E3_SS_l.html

Here is something from the Browning Fac
**Snip**
It is still assumed by many that the longer the shotgun barrel the farther the gun will shoot, the more effectively it will perform, and the more closely it will pattern. The facts are, however, whatever the gauge, barrel length has small effect on the velocity of the shot charge. With modern powders, the shot charge reaches maximum velocity after it has traveled a relatively short distance up the barrel bore. (So longer length of barrel does not make the pellets move faster or go farther.) Since the degree of choke controls the pattern of the shot at the target, proper barrel length is entirely a matter of desired weight, balance, and sight radius.
~ Source: Browning FAC

**Snip**



I am going to Quote Jerry Pardue and Tony Rumore now.

Jerry Pardue

**Snip**
Barrel Length
It is still assumed by many that the longer the shotgun barrel the farther the gun will shoot, the more effectively it will perform, and the more closely it will pattern.

The facts are, however, whatever the gauge, barrel length has small effect on the velocity of the shot charge. With modern powders, the shot charge reaches maximum velocity after it has traveled a relatively short distance up the barrel bore. (Longer length of barrel does not make the pellets move faster or go farther.) Since the degree of choke controls the pattern of the shot at the target the proper barrel length is entirely a matter of desired weight, balance, and sight radius. The longer 30 or 32 inch barrels add weight at the muzzle for steadiness, and provide a longer sighting plane for the slower, more deliberate swing required to hit more distant targets. The shorter barrels are preferred whenever quickness in getting a gun shouldered, and general ease of maneuverability, are important.

The size of the individual is also a consideration. A small person will likely be more accurate, even for distant targets, with a shorter barrel since the longer barrel may be uncomfortably heavy and slow.


**Snip**

Tony Rumore with a quote from Jason Hinkle

**snip**
This was posted by Jason Hinkle over on Subguns. Jason got me into the Saiga market back in 2004 and owns the very first prototype 12" Tromix SBS. He's a pretty colorful guy.......

Hinkle writes......

OK so I finally took most of the shotguns out for a spin on the old Chronograph. What I found is that, basically, those of you chuckleheads with no empirical data who have been yapping your cockholsters about how short barrels on shotguns seriously affect ballistics are fucking wrong. Lots of wrong. Like I said long ago, shotgun powder IS pistol powder- it burns fast and quick, and barrel length doesn't fucking matter that much.

I can't .PDF a spreadsheet on this computer so I'll get really slow and dumb like those who talk out their ass about ballistics with no basis in reality and list the average FPS for the shot strings.

First, using shitass birdshot- 12 gauge, 2 3/4 inches, 1 oz shot
12" barrel average FPS- 1040
14" barrel average FPS- 1069
18" barrel average FPS- 1114
19.5" barrel average FPS- 1114
20" barrel average FPS- 1108
28" barrel average FPS- 1159

Then using Remington 00 Buck-
12" barrel average FPS- 1121
14" barrel average FPS- 1127
18" barrel average FPS- 1216
19.5" barrel average FPS- 1205
20" barrel average FPS- 1182
28" barrel average FPS- 1250

Wow- 119-129 FPS velocity loss in 16 inches of barrel. That's devastating. Oh wait- no, it's actually not, it's fucking nothing at all and is actually about the same velocity variation in factory loaded ammo. I will feel as comfortable fucking up a bear using a shotgun with a 12 inch barrel as I would using one with a 28 inch barrel. Those of you clammering over 20 gauge Serbu Super Shortys rather than the biting sting of a 12 gauge to dust up a gravel pit should stick with the shortest of shotshells. I wouldn't want you to drop your purse while shooting.

**Snip**




Shot patterns produced using the same
12-gauge shotgun with shotshells
containing #4 shot pellets
Courtesy of Jack Dillon
http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/nij/training/firearms-training/module12/fir_m12_t06_12.htm


If you have read this far you ought to go ahead and click these links.
You may find just the factoid you are looking for.

http://firearmsid.com/A_distshotpatt.htm
http://www.myscienceproject.org/shooting.html
http://americangundog.com/straightshooting.html
 

Pops

Administrator
that is a lot of good info, thanx!

I think I'm going to stay in the shorter barrel length fo rmy shotgun project.
I think the 18.5" to 20" range will find a nice shotgun I can use.
I'll have to get me some of those short shells, tho, I don't want to drop my purse at the range, it gets so dusty on dry days there. . .


:lol:
Pops
 

jjwestbrook

New Member
I have a rem 870 with 20" rifle sights and remchoke
rem 1100 with 21" rifle sights and remchoke

2 rem 1187's 21" vent rib and remchokes
and a winchester 1300 22" vent rib and winchoke


the only advantage a long barrel gives you is a longer sight radius.
 

Range Master

New Member
Try the Federal Flte Control Buckshot loads. Reduced recoil or standard, they pattern phenomenally from short bbls! I have been very impressed.
 

Pops

Administrator
I have a remmington 1100 with a 28" barrel and an extended mag tube. It holds 9 shells in the tube.
I like it for the configuration and it is quite comfortable to shoot.
I think it really is a little long to be swinging around furniture, lamps and so forth.

I'm looking at a Remmington 870 with a rifle sighted 18" to 20" barrel.
I have plans for the stock and other features. Looks like it will cost about $600 for a new one the way I want it.

I'll probably end up finding a used receiver and customesing it the way I want it.

anybody looking to sell a rifle sighted 18" to 20" 870?

Pops
 

jjwestbrook

New Member
I bought a rem 1100 30" full choke barrel and wood was in great shape. blueing on receiver was worn. I sold the barrell and wood on gunbroker bought a 21" rifle sight rem choked barrel with the money. bought a mag ext. , pistol grip stock set , and side saddle , and a combat bolt handle.

-$200 for the gun
+ $135 for selling the barrel and wood
-$125 for new barrel
-$175 for stock set, mag ext, bolt handle
total cost of finished gun $365
 

btwiceborn

New Member
dont tell all that to the feds.
The longer barrel makes MORE muzzle velocity???
that means it is DEADLIER farther away...

maybe ALL shotguns should be sold to the general public with "Less than 18" barrels.
you know, require the tax stamp for those EVIL 28" monsters that are more deadly...
:lol:
 

dfloyd57

New Member
Pops said:
I have a remmington 1100 with a 28" barrel and an extended mag tube. It holds 9 shells in the tube.
I like it for the configuration and it is quite comfortable to shoot.
I think it really is a little long to be swinging around furniture, lamps and so forth.

I'm looking at a Remmington 870 with a rifle sighted 18" to 20" barrel.
I have plans for the stock and other features. Looks like it will cost about $600 for a new one the way I want it.

I'll probably end up finding a used receiver and customesing it the way I want it.

anybody looking to sell a rifle sighted 18" to 20" 870?

Pops

Stumbled across a site the other day that sells replacement barrels for remington shot guns. I've got a 870 that I'm thinking about changing the barrel to a shorter more defensive length.

If I can re-find the site, I'll post a link...
 
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